New Classified Ads system: we want your feedback! Now Live!

[nikita]

As posted in today's announcement:

Taking in the feedback that we've been receiving about keeping the Market a secure venue and trying to make feedback more useful overall, we've been looking around at what's available and we've decided that we'd like to try implementing a market-styled plugin for vBulletin that we've found and modified to suit our forum.

This plugin lets you post ads for your items by category, listing all the information just like your Market posts would. However each item is listed separately and buyers can browse by category or search for exactly the item they're looking for. In addition, this plugin has a built-in feedback system so that you can rate the buyer or seller that you just did a deal with.

Before we just go launching it across the site, we wanted to do a sort of "pre-release" so that you can all take a look at it and give us your honest feedback. We want to know what you think! Is this a good idea? Do you think you'd prefer this over the current Market setup? Can we improve on it? If so, how? If you don't like it, what don't you like about it? What would you prefer to see? Basically, we want to hear your opinion as the users who would be utilizing this service if we implement it for real. :D

At the moment, we've entered a couple of "example" ads and feedback posts. You're welcome to go in and try adding example ads of your own, and testing out the feedback system as well, trying to leave feedback for each other. Please be aware that this is a trial run. All ads and feedback posted during this period will be deleted after it is over! Please do not post real sales or real feedback! (And please only post feedback about someone if you know they won't mind. ^^)

If the overall feedback that we receive is positive, then we'll be looking at implementing this sometime early next week. :) At that time, we will ask you to move your sale items over to the new system. Obviously, some things will have to remain in the old Market format, such as commissions and customizations. But we're hoping that much of the Market -- and the feedback -- can be ported over to this new system instead. :)

So please take a look at the new market plugin (http://www.abjds.com/forum/sr_classifieds.php). We're looking forward to hearing your thoughts!

P.S. Right now all of you can see the Classifieds while we get your feedback, but when we implement it for real, the usual 25 post count restriction as per the rules will apply!

We really want your feedback on this! Tell us if you spot any type of bugs or we need to add/remove anything!

[Xi-feng]

First impressions are that I love it! I like that the eyes and wigs are seperated into different categories and that each item has its own individual listing and photograph - it seems far more fast and efficient than having to click on each thread in the marketplace and only then see if there's anything within those "18mm eyes" that are appealing.

And as a non-US-er, I have to say I love the fact that there's a category for Overseas Shipping costs so clearly visible. I can't wait until this system gets implemented!

[nakitama]

I really like it! I have a question though, are these ads only for things that are for sale? Or are they usable for WTBs too?

[nikita]

I really like it! I have a question though, are these ads only for things that are for sale? Or are they usable for WTBs too?

Click on the New Ad for any category. You will see a dropdown for the type of ad you want to place. We have included FS, FA, WTB and WTT.

[koalajoe]

I like it. I think it is clean and clear.

[Lady Brick]

Wow, this looks like it will make it really easy to find what you're looking for... can't wait to try it!

[miss sha]

I like it. :D It seem convenient and could be potentially easier than things are... I like how everything seems sort of automated and it's all clearly listed. I've got to see how it actually works in practice, but I think it definitely has the potential to be a lot more convenient. :D

[Defectivegirl]

OK! YAY I AM SO HAPPY YOU ALL DECIDED TO USE THIS!
Here are some things that need to be added:
~ under ad type put Feeler or Flr
~maybe a commission catagory (maybe one for athetics/facups/mods and one for clothing/accessories
~ is there an Auction function? I think there might be or at least a best offer function. That would be convenient!

If I think of anything else I will say so! YAY Again I love it. Keep up the gwed work!

[Xi-feng]

Suggestion : Having poked around a bit more, I think there's a need for a field saying where the seller is located. You've got local and overseas shipping listed, but unlike the old thread-system you can't look under the seller's name and see their location: 'local' and 'overseas' could mean anything, in that case!

[Hitasura]

Suggestion : Having poked around a bit more, I think there's a need for a field saying where the seller is located. You've got local and overseas shipping listed, but unlike the old thread-system you can't look under the seller's name and see their location: 'local' and 'overseas' could mean anything, in that case!

Ahaha, that's an excellent point! I'm sure we can add that in, so we'll try to do that soon!

[nikita]

OK! YAY I AM SO HAPPY YOU ALL DECIDED TO USE THIS!
Here are some things that need to be added:
~ under ad type put Feeler or Flr
~maybe a commission catagory (maybe one for athetics/facups/mods and one for clothing/accessories
~ is there an Auction function? I think there might be or at least a best offer function. That would be convenient!

If I think of anything else I will say so! YAY Again I love it. Keep up the gwed work!

We are looking into how we will implement "feelers" into the system.

As for Commissions, people can use this system. For now, we haven't added a Commissions category but if members want us to, we can!

No, you can't do auctions. The FA/For Auction one is if you have posted an auction on ebay. The plugin isn't designed to do auctions on its own.

[Leeda]

This is looking wonderful guys!

[sylvan leaf ~ Jaime]

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[Hitasura]

First thoughts are that its remarkablely easier to browse, and functions quite well. However, the second thought was concerning services such as commissioning clothing items or face-ups? How would this be worked into the new system? Being that commission are, by nature, not a one time event, it would not work well with a system that asks for a new ad for each item. Would commisions remain in the thread posting form?

~Jaime

We will likely be keeping the MP Commission forum open for this purpose, as like you said- they're not a one-time event, and they do require more communication between the buyer and seller. We are going to play with it a little more to see how commission services would be incorporated into the system as well. ^^

[inkstone]

Oh wow, I really like this!

[sgtgeorgecarter]

Would each commission slot be a separate ad?

Then maybe the completed commission in the ad for portfolio purposes?

[Karhys]

Well, old ads will be automatically purged from the system after 90 days (much like Ebay, Y!JA, etc) so having completed ads work like a portfolio system wouldn't actually work so well, either. (^^;

To my way of thinking, I feel that comissions would probably work better in the old style thread format, which allows more freedom for that sort of thing (plus no time limit) but if you can see a way that you think comissions would work better in the new format we're definitely open to suggestion. :D

[Bel]

Freaking awesome. Excellent idea.

[zalem]

I really like it. :) Though no way to have FA here and just have people PM their offers?

[Karhys]

We hadn't thought exactly about how the "FA" would be implemented other than just adding it as an option. That said, I think it'd be okay to list an Auction much the way one does in the Market and simply update the listed price each time one gets a new bid. One could state within the listing page that that was the top bid (and the bidder's initial, if necessary). I don't think that would be a problem. As the listings run for a certain amount of time, you could run it for the week specified or whatever. :)

(In case it's not easily obvious, you can edit your ad after posting it, just like you can edit your Market threads after you post them :) )

I think because it's so easily editable that this format of listing items allows a lot of room for manueverability.

I also included the "WTT" and "WTB" fields because you don't have to specify a price for your listing. That way, if you put WTT you can list your item and specify what you'd be willing to trade for instead of stating a price. If you want to put a WTB you can specify what you're after and instead of listing a price merely request to be PMed.

[Em]

I really like this new system, very user friendly! :D

Like Cass said, I think it's a good idea to keep the old forum format for commission threads...

[Tsuminaki]

It's got great potential :) looks organized, easy to use, and probably helpful against clutter!

[Ladyrixx]

I like it. Maybe we could have the eyes divied up by size and stuff like that, so if you just wanted to see all the 14mm eyes, or SD-sized wigs it would give you an option to see that whole category.

[cloverfirefly]

Love it! I'm keeping my fingers crossed that it works well in practice.

[nikita]

I like it. Maybe we could have the eyes divied up by size and stuff like that, so if you just wanted to see all the 14mm eyes, or SD-sized wigs it would give you an option to see that whole category.

We can't do sub-categories if that's what you mean. The plugin doesn't allow us to do that so we have to have all eye sizes in just one category.

[jerrysugarav]

This looks fantastic! I think it will make finding things so much easier and the built in feedback system looks amazing!

[Bel]

I know this is a smaller forum and therefore not a really big deal, but it's also cool that listings won't get bumped into oblivion.

I really like the format from an aesthetic viewpoint, too. This is the way I like to shop, and it solves the problem of sellers forgetting to edit their thread titles, so I click looking for !!!awesome!!! MSD clothes (for instance) and finding that the only remaining available item is a Hound shirt that the cat chewed.

[koi]

I like it, it looks really organized and accessible. I also like the feedback system.

[Melaidhrin]

It is so great! Finding things on DoA can be a pain, so this is refreshing. :)

[Boule de poils]

Even though I don't have access to the Market yet, I think this is a great idea! Makes looking for a particular item much easier and faster ^^

[kirane]

I like it too, for it's clean, straight to the point and still allows both seller and buyer some move. (does it make sense? he?)

[Soula]

That looks neat, professional even. Like a real webshop or auction site. That said, it's still buy/sell-at-own-risk, right? You will have no garantees or protection, isn't it?
(Apart from your standard Paypal protection, etc.)

I do not want to sound paranoid (but I probably am in this matter; I never buy/sell on forums), but I'm get a false sense of security from this. I see some posive/negative feedback, but where does that come from?

In short (to me), these listings will look forum-approved, or will there be an automatic disclaimer on every listing? I hope my hesitation makes sense.

[Hitasura]

That looks neat, professional even. Like a real webshop or auction site. That said, it's still buy/sell-at-own-risk, right? You will have no garantees or protection, isn't it?
(Apart from your standard Paypal protection, etc.)

I do not want to sound paranoid (but I probably am in this matter; I never buy/sell on forums), but I'm get a false sense of security from this. I see some posive/negative feedback, but where does that come from?

In short (to me), these listings will look forum-approved, or will there be an automatic disclaimer on every listing? I hope my hesitation makes sense.

yes, even with this new system, the MP/Classifieds would still be very much at the buyer/seller's own risk. We don't have the ability take responsibility if something goes wrong with the transaction.

Think of it this way: A newspaper prints ads for all sorts of things, but they are not held liable if something goes wrong with a transaction. The same applies here, and with any form of forum marketplace really.

As for the feedback, it will work almost the exact same way the current forun-based feedback system works. If you buy/sell something from a member, you leave them feedback for it. It's just automated in a similar to Ebay's feedback system. When you leave feedback, you will have to enter in a valid Classified number in order for it to be submitted. (note also that Feedback cannot be edited once it is left.)

[Soula]

Thanks for clarifying that, Hitasura. It just looked for a moment like a webshop to me.

So that means everyone would start with zero feedback here? Because I see many people are referencing their previous heaps of FB from DoA transactions in another thread here.

[Karhys]

Yep, in the beginning with this system, everyone will start with 0 feedback, because the system requires you to input a valid ID number for whichever ad you're leaving feedback for. Because of that, we'll leave the current feedback setup in place for the time being, so that people can still reference past feedback, as well as leaving the profile page links that cite offsite feedback (such as Ebay and DoA). (I may even be able to add links to these on the individual user feedback pages within the system.) Once people start to build up decent amounts of feedback in the system, we may be able to re-evaluate the feedback sub-forum, but for the indeterminate future I see no problem with keeping it as is. :)

Btw, thank you Xi-feng for the suggestion: I've now added "Location" as a part of the "Member Info" that's listed when you view someone's ad. This pulls directly from the "Location" field in your profile. This way you can easily see whether someone is local to you or whether you're paying OS shipping prices. :) I wanted to also add this to the category listing and search result pages (so that you could see the location of each item listed easily) but unfortunately this is beyond my limited PHP/MySQL capabilities. I will peg away at it and see if I can't eventually get it working though as I think it would be useful. :)

Oh and please all of you -- don't be afraid to make an ad or two to test out the system. Or leave some feedback. (I don't mind if you post feedback about me, for example. ;) )

ETA: I've added links to each user's Resinality, DoA and Ebay feedback links (if they have them) on their feedback page within this new system -- please check my feedback page (http://www.abjds.com/forum/sr_classifieds.php?do=user&userid=5) to see how it looks. :)

[Zozolala]

I like it very much, and I can't wait to try it out. It's wonderful that you can see pictures of the items that are offered! It will save so much time :)
I was just thinking about a feature like that the other day, when I tried to search DoA's Marketplace for brown boots - I gave up after clicking the 95.625th link only to find another pair in black.

[Songblade]

this is SO awesome and the pictures make every item so clear! Perhaps it's a bit cold, like ebay, but eh :) Overall, I like it. Will there be a way for people to put in their colorful post formats, like "shop" banners and such?

[Karhys]

Songblade, you can put pretty much anything that you want into your post. :) The plugin uses the same vBulletin format and BBcode to create posts that you use on the rest of the forum -- so anything you want to include, images, smileys, external links, whatever -- it can all be included in your ad. I think it would be pretty easy for people to just make up a basic template for their ads and then copy and paste it to each one, just changing the few things that need changing per ad. (That's largely what I did with the example ads. :))

[Xi-feng]

The whole thing's looking just about perfect now - great work, guys, and thanks to all those who implemented it :)

Can't wait until it goes live!

[Sola]

Since items are selling relatively slowly now, would there be a way to extend the ad time (say 120 days instead of 90) ? Much longer than that would just seem silly, though.

[Karhys]

Absolutely, that's one of the easiest things to change. :) I actually haven't setup the auto-delete yet, but I don't mind setting it to 120 days when I do, and it should be no problem to add the extra option to the ad listings themselves!

ETA: I've added the option of "3 months" to listings, and auto-delete will be 4 months now. :)

[Songblade]

Good to hear, Cassiel! I suppose this does away with bumping threads then? What if a seller wants to keep an item more than 3 months? Are they not allowed?

[Karhys]

Yes, this completely does away with thread bumping! :) But in a good way -- because people can just search for what they're interested in which makes it quite a bit easier!

If people want to keep items up for more than 3 months, they're more than welcome to re-submit them. I don't think we're going to have any sort of limit on how long an item can be posted! Merely that they'll have to re-submit the ad if they do. I think that with a 3 month limit, a majority of items should (hopefully!) move much quicker than that so theoretically it wouldn't cause too much problems. :) (And yes, I do have to set a time limit, it's coded into the way the plugin works. ;))

If it proves to be problematic for a lot of people, we can probably up the time limit further, but we'll see how it goes. This is as much of an experiment for us as for you guys! I'm hoping that everyone will continue to give us feedback on it once it's running so that we can tweak it to suit everyone's needs as much as possible. :) I'm really happy to have everyone's input and we want to be as accomodating as possible!

[Tahiel]

Whee, on what I've seen so far I definitely love it. :)

[lyrajean]

I notice the price field states s/pecificly not to put a $ symbol. What about those of us in foreign countries? If I want to price my items in yen, or euro or HKD, or AUS dollars. We have enough members in those countries.

[catcooter]

My first impressions are good. I like the little thumbnail picture right there where I can see it at first glance. It's also nice having price and shipping there too. If I think I'm really interested then I can go in and investiage further.

[ginarolo]

I like the look of the ads. How would you do something for several items? Would each item get an ad? Is there a minimum number of ads you could have at one time? Could you cluster all the sellers same ads together?

Also is there a place for item on HOLD.??

[nikita]

I notice the price field states s/pecificly not to put a $ symbol. What about those of us in foreign countries? If I want to price my items in yen, or euro or HKD, or AUS dollars. We have enough members in those countries.

I'm going to let Cassiel answer this one since she knows more about the backend of the plugin and if it's possible or not to do additional currencies.

I like the look of the ads. How would you do something for several items? Would each item get an ad? Is there a minimum number of ads you could have at one time? Could you cluster all the sellers same ads together?

Also is there a place for item on HOLD.??

For the individual seller, they would list one item per ad. There is no minimum number of ads.

Now, it is possible to post a "lot" or "set" of items in one ad, just like on ebay when someone sells a "lot" of clothing or set of items. Then people will pay just one prices for this.

As far as clustering ads together by the same seller, no. The point of the classified ad system is to make it easier for buyers to find what they are looking for. It's just like when a seller posts on ebay or in the newspaper.

If an item needs to be placed on hold, the seller has the power to edit the ad and put "HOLD" in the title.

[St. James]

This seems like a great idea for selling off random items, but what about those of us who have shops? For example, it would be an incredible amount of extra work for ginrolo to list and track each pair of eyes for sale, wouldn't it? And I'm not sure how I'd list our jewelry shop either, because we make things to order even more often than we sell the in stock items we have posted (i.e. we get a lot of "I want ___ ring but in a different size.").

[Hitasura]

This seems like a great idea for selling off random items, but what about those of us who have shops? For example, it would be an incredible amount of extra work for ginrolo to list and track each pair of eyes for sale, wouldn't it? And I'm not sure how I'd list our jewelry shop either, because we make things to order even more often than we sell the in stock items we have posted (i.e. we get a lot of "I want ___ ring but in a different size.").

We are still debating how to best handle this, so we're open to suggestions! As we mentioned before, some types of things are better suited for the traditional forum-based shop, so we'll likely be keeping a MP forum open for commissionable services and those who run shops and shopping services.

It also might be worth noting here as well that one ad can be used repeatedly to sell more than one of the same item- the ad can be edited to reflect how many of that particular item is available.

Being someone who also runs a small shop, I definitely understand your concern here, so we'll be doing our best to find a solution that will suit everyone's needs! ^^

[St. James]

We are still debating how to best handle this, so we're open to suggestions! As we mentioned before, some types of things are better suited for the traditional forum-based shop, so we'll likely be keeping a MP forum open for commissionable services and those who run shops and shopping services.

It also might be worth noting here as well that one ad can be used repeatedly to sell more than one of the same item- the ad can be edited to reflect how many of that particular item is available.

Being someone who also runs a small shop, I definitely understand your concern here, so we'll be doing our best to find a solution that will suit everyone's needs! ^^

Oh, good. It almost sounded like shops were going to be discouraged because that's a lot of extra work. :sweat We have a lot of explanatory information in our shop post that would be tedious for buyers if we had to list it on each item. Perhaps there could be a threaded MP forum for established higher volume shops that always have basic items in stock? It may kill sales traffic initially the same way the DoA marketplace split did, but it worked out alright after a few months.

As a buyer I really like the ad idea, and I'll definitely use it to sell the assorted wigs and shoes I have sitting around. :pirate

[Karhys]

I notice the price field states s/pecificly not to put a $ symbol. What about those of us in foreign countries? If I want to price my items in yen, or euro or HKD, or AUS dollars. We have enough members in those countries.

I totally understand the multi-currency desire but at the moment I'm not sure whether we can support it. :oops I'm going to go and look into the backend but as the plugin is at the moment, if you enter a price yourself with a dollar-sign it actually doesn't work; it resets the price to zero. I don't know if this is true with other currency symbols. I'll definitely look into it though, so give me a bit of time and I'll let you know whether it's possible. :)

(That said, even as an Aussie I always just trade in US$ regardless as it's easier, heh! But I understand the multi-currency concern.)

Oh, good. It almost sounded like shops were going to be discouraged because that's a lot of extra work. :sweat We have a lot of explanatory information in our shop post that would be tedious for buyers if we had to list it on each item. Perhaps there could be a threaded MP forum for established higher volume shops that always have basic items in stock? It may kill sales traffic initially the same way the DoA marketplace split did, but it worked out alright after a few months.

We totally understand that for shops this really isn't all that feasible! We wanted to implement this largely to address the concerns of people selling various unrelated single items which from experience is the majority of sellers in Market sub-forums that I've seen.

What we were thinking for shops was possible to keep two Market sub-forums: one specifically for shops like yourself and Gina and another for commissions and customizers (basically, anyone who makes or sells a product that's made-to-order rather than completed before sale). That said though we're totally open to suggestions so we'd like to know what you think. :)

Another thought that we had along this vein is that we could possibly have a single category area in the new system called "Advertising" where shops, customizers, etc could post an ad for their Market thread (or off-site store) instead of a specific item for sale. Then people who were interested in that sort of thing could browse that category while in the new plug-in. It would be another way for them to find your threads. For those of you running stores or doing commissions, do you think this is a good idea or do you not think it would help? For those of you simply browsing ads, do you think you would visit this category? (As I said, we're still playing with ideas here so we really want and value your input! :)

Oh, almost forgot: Gina asked about clustering ads from a single seller -- you can use the search feature of the plugin to search for a seller's name as well as an item name. :) So if you do that it'll show you all the auctions from that seller. (Like if you wanted to get a few items to save on shipping. ;))

[St. James]

What we were thinking for shops was possible to keep two Market sub-forums: one specifically for shops like yourself and Gina and another for commissions and customizers (basically, anyone who makes or sells a product that's made-to-order rather than completed before sale).
I think this sounds like a good idea. We can pack as much information into one thread as we can, it won't expire, and we can always ask the mods to delete any posts it generates. :)
The possibility of placing advertisements for the shop threads or offsite shops is good too, but I think that segregating it to another area called Advertising would defeat the purpose because it will get browsed a lot less than the general classifieds. It would be more effective if ads could be placed in each category as though they were in newspaper classifieds, because otherwise there isn't nearly enough browser traffic. Ads are meant to catch the attention of people who aren't currently looking for that item or shop, rather than the people who already know a company exists, if you know what I mean.

[Karhys]

Thank you everyone for your feedback! The Classifieds are now officially open for use! Please read the announcement (http://www.abjds.com/forum/showthread.php?t=874) regarding them. :D

[Pirate Reine]

When I first saw it before it was locked, it was really cool and a great concept!
VERY EFFICENT TOO!

[Kahli]

yay-- I finally got enough "points" to get in to see it and I love that format! easy to find specific items and a photo right up front to see what's inside.

Of course, I found something I wanted right away. Sadly, I can't get him right now. :(
But I give three thumbs up (a mutant-thumbs-up) for the marketplace!
vicki